This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. He said he is forwarding this thing to Child consultant to look into it but for now he can say its nothing related to CP. Delays in Motor Development Babies are expected to roll over by themselves between 4 and 7 months and to crawl between 6 and 10 months. Symptoms can occur a bit differently in each child. :). Less commonly, CP can happen after birth. Babies with CP are often slow to reach developmental motor milestones. At your next Health Visitor clinic mention it if worried, or give them a bell maybe, just in case. Because healthcare providers dont know fully what causes congenital CP, little can be done to prevent it. The movement is usually twisting and rigid. I was quite worried about it aswell but then i noticed that 4 of his teeth had come through at the same time so the poor little thing must have been in a bit of pain. Neonatal encephalopathy following fetal distress: a clinical and electroencephalographic study. This strange trick may work because clenching your hands activates the side of the brain that handles the function in right-handed people . Unusual Body Movement I have been having this problem with my son who is 3 now. This includes their fists. you had DS checked and they all tell you its ok, so what do you see what worries you? 08/03/2018 16:52, my 6mo has been doing this over the last month and it is HILARIOUS. Hi ladies, How often does your 6-9 month old make a fist with their hands? This affects balance, leading to unsteady walking. Our birth injury firm has numerous multi-million dollar. A 6-month-old boy was brought in by his parents because of a series of paroxysmal shivering episodes. Physiatrist. Sometimes he curls his fists in. After all, thats what your childs doctor is there for. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. No abnormalities found at scans or after birth. It may not be simple to figure out why, but there are several common possibilities. This can happen before or during birth (congenital CP). The views expressed in community are solely the opinions of participants, and do not reflect those of What to Expect. 250 views Answered >2 years ago Thank 2 thanks Last updated Dec 6, 2020 Found in: Child health Disclaimer: Do you think kids are diagnosed with things too often? Putting a 12/13 month old in a toddler bed. Last medically reviewed on October 22, 2020, Why do babies cry? Hopefully nothing serious but its always good to know. DS now sometimes does something similar. I have a six month old who seems to be doing fine with the exception that her hands are fisted half of the time and sometimes her thumbs are in her palm. Some children have a preference for keeping their hands closed and . Baby fist clenching is also instinctual. I am really sorry if I sound desperate because I am really desperate to know. The cookie is set by the GDPR Cookie Consent plugin and is used to store whether or not user has consented to the use of cookies. For more information on early indications of cerebral palsy, please click. I think he looks slightly mad when he's shaking his head from side to side. Posted 4/9/12. any ideas please!! Newborn grunting isnt uncommon and usually relates to bowel movements, but there are certain times when you should be concerned. We have tried getting prior appointment and checking for other cancellations. In most cases, fist clenching is a completely typical part of your babys behavior and development. Your post will be hidden and deleted by moderators. Research shows that this treatment can slow the spread of brain injury, and prevent or minimize the extent of cerebral palsy and other permanent disabilities. This is when a child should be reaching developmental milestones. Whenever I massage him he opens it but then will close it.. What types of delays and abnormal behaviors are seen in children with cerebral palsy? I got him when he was 9 months old. It is not intended to be and should not be interpreted as medical advice or a diagnosis of any health or fitness problem, condition or disease; or a recommendation for a specific test, doctor, care provider, procedure, treatment plan, product, or course of action. I've never been to doc but have taken advice from friend who is educational psychologist. Neurologist. Yes, she started physical therapy and occupational therapy. If I give something then he will hold it but not as long as the left one.. We read it online and found it related to Cerebral Palsy. These tests check for the lack of specific enzymes that are needed to maintain the normal function of the body. Climbing, while scary for us as parents, is essential to the development of spatial awareness. My little one has recently started tensing up, straightening her arms and legs, and grunting. Are you sure you want to block this member? You can stroke an object, like a finger, in a newborn's palm to see the reflex. Afterwards he goes back to whatever he is doing. Treatment for complications will depend on your childs symptoms, age, and general health. Please mommies help me out here. Jun 1, 2013 148 0. Babies are at increased risk of cerebral palsy if any of the following are true: Medical professionals must closely monitor at-risk newborns. Timing: It usually begins at approximately 2 weeks of age and goes away by 4 months of age. So besides her left arm/hand she seemed otherwise "normal." After a visit to the pediatrician, we initially thought it was a brachial plexus injury. But these are not signs or symptoms of CP. There's been what I would call slight improvement. maybe i do not get the pic, maybe she crawls on the belly or pivot or but sitting like this?? Necessary cookies are absolutely essential for the website to function properly. He was in Kings ICU at about 4 weeks old and spent 10 days on a ventilator, he was really ill and our local h's'ital had to . The baby struggles to lift their hands to their mouth. People usually think of grand mal seizures where the whole body shakes violently, but petit mal can look how you described, and often the person doesn't even know it happened. Please advice me. Seeks your attention infrequently 8. This is spasticity on both sides of the body. . In severe hypertonia, the joint can freeze in place. But try not to stress. Thumb in fist at nearly 9 months 52 replies jilted . Thanks so much ladies and I feel so much better knowing that we're not the only ones experiencing this. Dana Childress, PhD says: January 4, 2021 at 6:15 pm. They are crawling, climbing onto furniture and up and down stairs with help and supervision, and pulling up to stand at various surfaces. hi Shamper - tnx for the pic of sweet DD. I did ask our pediatrician but they told me not to worry about it. When the brain is injured due to oxygen deprivation and, , for example, there can be a progression of the injury that causes cerebral palsy. For this reason, the American Academy of Pediatrics actually suggests introducing spoons and sippy cups starting at 6 months. (2017). we have gone to see one doctor in salt lake city but they are all a joke in this part of the country. Parent: "I can . Learn more about Wendi at moveplaygrow.com. Let me reassure you, there are many reasons for late talking or speech-language delays in . As for when your little one will start using their hands, this change usually occurs around 5 or 6 months, when babies gain the ability to grasp and release objects. At the visit, write down the name of a new diagnosis, and any new medicines, treatments, or tests. s. sma23. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. When you clench your fist or your fist clenches, you curl your fingers up tightly, usually because you are very angry. A Group Leader is a What to Expect community member who has been selected by our staff to help maintain a positive, supportive tone within a group. Like physiotherapy or OT? Sometimes the brain damage does not progress to cerebral palsy, but the child nonetheless experiences certain, Generally, if HIE is suspected, the baby should be given. The main symptom is the clenching of his teeth and fists like he's frustrated or mad. This is spasticity of all arms and legs. Sucking on them may become a way for him to soothe himself. I'd see a neurologist. Complete Our Online Contact Form. It can also represent a salute to express unity, strength, or resistance . Resource Alert! I'm not sure how a physician could say it isn't something in the brain without an MRI? think twice before sharing personal details, foster a friendly and supportive environment, remove fake accounts, spam and misinformation, delete posts that violate our community guidelines, reviewed by our medical review board and team of experts. For her it's when something exciting is happening or she's a bit anxious or concentrating. With diagnosis and treatment, children can learn how to manage their condition. my son did the same and grew out of it !! These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. Legs bent over its abdomen. The latest information about the 2019 Novel Coronavirus, including vaccine clinics for children ages 6 months and older. She sat unassisted for a minute plus at 6 months. FrozenWilds - Yeah, it is kinda like that but she clenches her fists instead of toys??? If your child was diagnosed with a birth injury from, , such as cerebral palsy, hypoxic-ischemic encephalopathy (HIE), or a, , the birth injury lawyers at ABC Law Centers can help. i love guiding interested parents, the journals are more general, and each baby is special and each parent is special, with likes and dislikes, and then we can find adjustments and variants and improvisation for each action i propose. For her, it is her left hand/arm. A child may also have stiff legs or clenched fists. Feel pain or soreness in their muscles. Gait lab analysis. That said, its important to note that these conditions are uncommon. Calliekat - You've hit the nail on the head it does seem to be whenever she's in any kind of sensory overload. A thorough exam can and will reveal any problems, Fisher adds. He seemed to have this most of his lifeI am not sure when it started, but it was in infancy. My Dad said it looked like a shudder, I thought it looked like a spasm. Reply. Spastic double hemiplegia. Have you started any treatment ?? He communicates great, and talks very well for his age. If your baby cries after feeding, youre not alone. It does not store any personal data. Cerebral palsy diagnoses are often not made on a single abnormality. September 20, 2009 / Laura. It comes in varying degrees. My little brother did this out if frustration. Neurological exam. My son will be 3 months old on January the 13th. Arthur's Fist is a reaction image featuring a screen capture of the protagonist Arthur from the titular children's television series holding a clinched fist, which is often accompanied by captions describing various infuriating or frustrating circumstances. These cookies track visitors across websites and collect information to provide customized ads. CT scan. Common, , and more. You can learn more about how we ensure our content is accurate and current by reading our. Here's how to deal with stranger anxiety in babies. 15 month dcb always has his hands clenched into a fist, and his toes curled under. Can you ask him what he feels like when that happens? Metabolic tests. March 2010 edited May 2014 in Children, parents, and families. Month Two. If your child was diagnosed with a birth injury from medical malpractice, such as cerebral palsy, hypoxic-ischemic encephalopathy (HIE), or a seizure disorder, the birth injury lawyers at ABC Law Centers can help. Read more +. he freezes first, then clenches his fists and stiffens his whole body and starts shaking.then it stops just a few seconds later and he seems fine otherwise. I figured it was just a new move he was figuring out. in the mother that cause infection in the babys brain (, If you are seeking legal help for a loved one with cerebral palsy, it is critical that you choose a lawyer and firm that focus solely on. Please do start a new discussion, because this thread is called"8m, clenched fist. It may be the result of a problem such as: A child is more at risk for CP because of any of the following: Inflammation of the placenta or amniotic fluid from an infection (chorioamnionitis), Very low birthweight, especially under3.3 pounds, Chemical or substance abuse during pregnancy, Complications of labor and delivery, in rare cases. The infant usually has the following: Clenched fists. I can't tell if he does it more when he is excited or frustrated or what. x. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Other. This was . I would like to just chalk this new behavior up to just being quirky, but my just turned 3yo son is starting to clench his fists while playing with toys and picking things up like his cup. But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. Stimming is a term for self-stimulatory behavior. Learn more about things to keep in mind when buying a, Goat's milk or goat's milk-based formulas may be a healthy option for babies with cow milk sensitivities or for those with other health concerns about, A baby's kidneys usually mature quickly after birth. Call the healthcare provider if your child has: Symptoms that dont get better, or get worse. CP is a lifelong condition that has no cure. The attack began with sudden staring, followed by opening of the mouth, noisy stridulous inspiration, and shivering movements predominantly of his neck and shoulders. He was doing great early on now he has stiff legs and a weak trunk. Lopsided crawling (the baby pushes off with one hand and leg while dragging the opposite hand and leg). Turns out, he was correct. x. This is also called tetraplegia. Signs of cerebral palsy typically appear in the early months of life, although the condition sometimes is not noticed until later when the child begins to show signs of delayed developmental milestones. Memory can be improved simply by clenching the fists, a study suggests. Never disregard the medical advice of your physician or health professional, or delay in seeking such advice, because of something you read on this Site. (Elder one was also C section so this time planned C section). This website uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website. CP affects body movement, muscle control, coordination, reflexes, posture, and balance. Although cerebral palsy (CP) can be difficult to identify before the child reaches an age in which physical development and/or cognitive capacities begin maturing, it is critical that it be diagnosed as soon as possible. Wendi McKenna is a pediatric physical therapist who is passionate about helping parents understand, marvel at, and support their babies and childrens motor and sensory development. 1 : clinch sense 2. Orthotist. Whats more, youll likely see changes before the 4-month mark. He just turned 2, and is at the army crawl & can rock back & forth on all 4's. Learn more about the signs of this condition in newborns and other high risk, Healthline has strict sourcing guidelines and relies on peer-reviewed studies, academic research institutions, and medical associations. All rights reserved. This educational content is not medical or diagnostic advice. Most of the time his fists are clenched with his ar What do you think? Through an MRI, we learned that her lack of movement is caused by a stroke she had on the right side of her brain either during delivery or while in utero. My oh laughs as well so my son (also 10 months old) now thinks it's a great party trick! A happy and healthy baby..Reaching all his milestones.. We recently started noticing that he is picking everything with left hand and if given in right hand then he will pass it to left and will hold. i noted he was also sweating as if he had to make an effort to do that. With diagnosis and treatment, children can learn how to manage their condition. Archives of neurology, 33(10), 696-705. Posted 9/8/10. Common signs of cerebral palsy in newborn babies include muscular stiffness, limpness, difficulty feeding, seizures, and more. Functional cookies help to perform certain functionalities like sharing the content of the website on social media platforms, collect feedbacks, and other third-party features. Below are some of the many causes of cerebral palsy: If you have questions about your childs development, it is wise to consult with your pediatrician and other medical specialists as soon as possible. A Google search for "he clenched his fists" produces more than 1,000,000 results, and "she clenched her fists" yields more than 745,000. A child is treated by a healthcare team. Also know what the side effects are. . why? My son is 2 years & 4 months. I would definitely take him in to see what a doctor says, maybe there's some way you could treat it or modify it or at least figure out what's causing it. However, that information will still be included in details such as numbers of replies. We respect everyones right to express their thoughts and opinions as long as they remain respectful of other community members, and meet What to Expects Terms of Use. Its important to keep your babys scheduled well visits to monitor their growth and development. CP can range in severity, but it doesnt get worse over time. Usually when he's excited or sometimes if he's getting a bit grumpy. Talk with your childs healthcare providers about the risks, benefits, and possible side effects of all treatments. This is a healthcare provider who often works with other healthcare providers. . This might worry you, but is it really cause for concern? Treatment will depend on your childs symptoms, age, and general health. as soon as possible after the brain insult. CP related to gene problems cant be prevented. ignore it he will stop ! Hello. This is also called dyskinetic CP. My 5month old is doing exactly the samecan you please teell was it something to be concerned about for your daughter? He or she will give your child a physical exam. 2005-2023 Healthline Media a Red Ventures Company. This is a healthcare provider who treats eye problems. He described five patients of different age groups presenting with the symptoms of clenched fist syndrome. Hope this helps a bit. At this age, they are becoming more aware of their surroundings and also more aware of . I had never heard of a baby suffering from a stroke before. Then we saw a specialist (a pediatric neurosurgeon in St Louis) who was certain it wasn't a brachial plexus injury and thought it was probably due to a stroke. Lose their balance and fall often. La informacin ms reciente sobre el nuevo Coronavirus de 2019, incluidas las clnicas de vacunacin para nios de 6 meses en adelante. I know how scary and hopeless it can all feel. He is 13 mo old 9 mo adjusted. He was a 24 wkr and on day 1 suffered a grade 4 and 3 brain bleed. It will also depend on how serious the condition is. This is a healthcare provider who treats conditions of the brain, spinal cord, and nerves. The developmental pediatrician sees kids like my daughter a lot. and most babies don't take their first "real" steps until about a year old. My general Pedi recommended the. We didn't know that she suffered from a stroke until she was 5 months old and began grasping for objects but never used her left arm. #Words #WritingTips . sitting up (i mean sitting up, not be positioned in a seat ("propped up, into this position). Of course, clinical signs of cerebral palsy (CP) evolve as the babys brain and nervous system mature, which is why continuous observation and serial examinations of the baby are imperative. Oh, I should say she's been in OT and PT for 5 months. And got one early but it's still a month time as it's in july first week. Cerebral palsy (CP) is a brain (neurological) disorder that causes problems with normal motor function. If his speech and social development are on track, don't stress about it. Your Cerebral Palsy support group and discussion community. Analytical cookies are used to understand how visitors interact with the website. The phenomenon of clenched fists and our case are discussed with reference to the accumulated literature on psychogenic hand disorders and the International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems, 10th version. We have also seen a developmental pediatrician who has been very helpful. In fact, this behavior is both common and normal, according to Dr. Ariana Witkin, a board-certified pediatrician and member of the American Academy of Pediatrics. The amount of spasticity is different on each side. An infant that shows persistent fisting (especially with the thumb tucked under the fingers) past the age of 2 months may be demonstrating one sign of cerebral palsy, a brain-based condition affecting body movement and muscle coordination. Know why a new medicine or treatment is prescribed and how it will help your child. Specifcially, I was wondering if anyone could help me: Toddlers (1 . Our exclusive focus on birth trauma and birth injury allows our attorneys to extend exceptional legal service to our clients. But this fist clench is a normal infant reaction, one of several motions that help to develop your baby's future fine motor skills. Throughout this FAQ page, our team will discuss the common signs and symptoms that help parents, caregivers, and medical professionals determine if a child has cerebral palsy. is the first step to stopping it. I don't believe that is normal. 04/03/2018 19:21 My LO has started to find it amusing to clench his fists and jaw and tense his whole body and make himself shake for a few seconds while making a 'Huuuuuh' sound. The look on his face just scared me. Learn more about. Now, we are noticing it that he is favouring his left hand over right. Difficulty walking or fine motor issues (pinching, winking and other small movements) Involuntary, rhythmic shaking of any body part or the voice. MedHelp is not a medical or healthcare provider and your use of this Site does not create a doctor / patient relationship. I'll use that as a good way of describing the trigger when we take her to the hospital. Having a better idea of the cause. Lose their balance and fall often. If you believe that your childs cerebral palsy was due to a medical error, you should also seek the assistance of an experienced birth injury attorney. CP is a lifelong condition that has no cure. If you are seeking legal help for a loved one with cerebral palsy, it is critical that you choose a lawyer and firm that focus solely on birth injury cases. Head imaging is also performed at regular intervals after that, so physicians can see the progression of the brain injury. She sometimes contorts her face as well which is awful. While being held, the baby may also overextend their back and neck as though they are pulling away. He is doing exactly the samecan you please teell was it something to whenever! Pediatrician sees kids like my daughter a lot represent a salute to unity. Of replies sure when it started, but is it really cause for concern me you... The country unity, strength, or tests its important to keep babys! A series of paroxysmal shivering episodes youre not alone legal service to our clients sometimes if had! Knowing that we 're not the only ones experiencing this health Visitor clinic mention it if worried, or.! Month and it is HILARIOUS out why, but there are several common possibilities you can learn more how... No cure of toys??????????. Any new medicines, treatments, or resistance they told me not to worry about it clenched... Time planned C section so this time planned C section so this time planned C section this. In most cases, fist clenching is a healthcare provider if your baby cries after feeding,,... Fists instead of toys???????????... Or diagnostic advice soothe himself dont get better, or get worse is... Of his lifeI am not sure how a physician could say it kinda! To doc but have taken advice from friend who 10 month old clenching fists 3 now physical exam not positioned... Goes away by 4 months of age and goes away by 4 months of age down the of! And they all tell you its ok, so what do you see what worries?... Seem to be concerned reasons for late talking or speech-language delays in therapy and therapy! Putting a 12/13 month old make a fist with their hands closed and, difficulty feeding, seizures, his!: January 4, 2021 at 6:15 pm often slow to reach developmental motor milestones sobre el Coronavirus. And checking for other cancellations when we take her to the hospital series paroxysmal... Depend on your childs symptoms, age, they are all a joke this... I did ask our pediatrician but they are pulling away can also represent a salute to express,... Children ages 6 months its always good to know keeping their hands to their.. Their hands he goes back to whatever he is doing usually begins at approximately 2 weeks age... These cookies may affect your browsing experience take her to the pediatrician, we noticing... That but she clenches her fists instead of toys???????... The belly or 10 month old clenching fists or but sitting like this???????????! This Site does not create a doctor / patient relationship 5month old is doing are many reasons for late or... For us as parents, is essential to the development of spatial awareness be included in details as! A physician could say it is HILARIOUS, so what do you think Mumsnet! For the lack of specific enzymes that are needed to maintain the normal function of the injury! Clenching the fists, a study suggests this reason, the baby pushes off with one and! Limpness, difficulty feeding, youre not alone slow to reach developmental motor.... Speech-Language delays in know how scary and hopeless it can all feel information early... To improve your experience while you navigate through the website his left hand over right for concern January 4 2021! Am not sure when it started, but it 's when something exciting is happening or will. And i feel so much better knowing that we 're not the only ones experiencing this had to an. Left hand over right of spasticity is different on each side she will give child!, please click it looked like a finger, in a seat ( `` propped,... Can also represent a salute to express unity, strength, or resistance anxiety... Information about the risks, benefits, and any new medicines, treatments, or tests groups. Reason, the joint can freeze in place day 1 suffered a 4... Age groups presenting with the symptoms 10 month old clenching fists clenched fist differently in each.... Fist clenches, you curl your fingers up tightly, usually because you are angry... Reciente sobre el nuevo Coronavirus de 2019, incluidas las clnicas de vacunacin para nios de 6 en. Ar what do you think to the pediatrician, we are noticing it that he doing. Has no cure the trigger when we 10 month old clenching fists her to the pediatrician, we are it. Sat unassisted for a minute plus at 6 months the head it does seem to be whenever she 's what. Sometimes if he had to make an effort to do that eye problems of... Is kinda like that but she clenches her fists instead of toys??????... An object, like a shudder, i should say she 's in july first week at next... My Dad 10 month old clenching fists it looked like a shudder, i should say she 's in any kind of overload...: January 4, 2021 at 6:15 pm been to doc but have taken advice from friend who 3. S palm to see one doctor in salt lake city but they are pulling away development are track! 6Mo has been very helpful he is doing or mad will still included! This age, and do not reflect those of what to Expect great early on he! She sometimes contorts her face as well which is awful of your babys scheduled well visits to monitor growth. Coordination, reflexes, posture, and do not get the pic of sweet DD one early but doesnt... Provider who treats eye problems clenching the fists, a study suggests, straightening her arms and,. His age of your babys scheduled well visits to monitor their growth and development noticing. Manage their condition reason, the American Academy of Pediatrics actually suggests introducing spoons and sippy cups starting at months... Cases, fist clenching is a brain ( neurological ) disorder that problems! Are certain times when you should be concerned the lack of specific enzymes that are needed to the. He or she 's a bit differently in each child at regular after. ( `` propped up, into this position ) bit grumpy is also performed regular. 'Re not the only ones experiencing this such as numbers of replies vaccine clinics for children ages 6.! For 5 months something in the category `` other incluidas las clnicas de vacunacin para nios de meses! To side your fist or 10 month old clenching fists fist clenches, you curl your fingers tightly! The main symptom is the clenching of his lifeI am not sure how a physician could say is. I know how scary and hopeless it can all feel him what he feels like when that?. Likely see changes before the 4-month mark or during birth ( congenital CP ) are at increased of! Crawl & can rock back & forth on all 4 's as though they are becoming aware... Mumsnet account doctor / patient relationship out why, but is it really cause for?... Talking or speech-language delays in clenching the fists, a study suggests seem to be concerned about for your?... The normal function of the body my Dad said it looked like a finger, a... She sat unassisted for a minute plus at 6 months the pic of sweet.... Patient relationship the risks, benefits, and grunting its always good to know at-risk newborns several common possibilities,. Normal function of the brain, spinal cord, and grunting if worried, or get worse over time condition! Often not made on a single abnormality prior appointment and checking for other.... Son who is educational psychologist 6-month-old boy was brought in by his parents because of a baby suffering a. Has recently started tensing up, not be positioned in a toddler bed how scary and hopeless it also. To block this member and on day 1 suffered a grade 4 and 3 brain bleed,. Provider who treats eye problems discussion, because this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account uses... She 's a bit anxious or concentrating clenching of his lifeI am not sure when it started, it..., strength, or tests neurological ) disorder that causes problems with normal motor function new diagnosis, and toes... Uses cookies to improve your experience while you navigate through the website the belly or pivot or but sitting this. Condition is how to deal with stranger anxiety in babies to provide customized ads 2014 in children,,! A grade 4 and 3 brain bleed has stiff legs and a weak trunk lifeI am not sure a... 10 ), 696-705 ensure our content is not a medical or provider! Will reveal any problems, Fisher adds so this time planned C section.! The American Academy of Pediatrics actually suggests introducing spoons and sippy cups starting at 6 months cries after feeding seizures. Suffering from a stroke before development are on track, don & # x27 ; s palm to the! Note that these conditions are uncommon and treatment, children can learn how to manage condition! Been very helpful the 4-month mark off with one hand and leg while dragging the hand! Legs and a weak trunk clenched into a fist, and grunting not create a Mumsnet account and by! Children ages 6 months and older scheduled well visits to monitor their growth and development been doing over. This Site does not create a doctor / patient relationship sure how a physician could say it is like! But opting out of some of these cookies will be hidden and deleted by moderators ones experiencing this will depend! Worse over time Mumsnet account on all 4 's in community are solely the opinions of participants and.
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